| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" 09:08 - Mar 2 with 1514 views | hype313 |
But what are they supposed to do? it's like all of us hitting the streets with our wooden spoons up against trained military with weapons, how are they supposed to "take over"?
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| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 09:12 - Mar 2 with 1472 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
Don't sweat the detail! |  |
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| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 09:14 - Mar 2 with 1475 views | DJR |
I get the impression that Trump is effectively saying that if the Iranian people don't rise up and overthrow the regime, then it is their fault. |  | | |
| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 09:15 - Mar 2 with 1454 views | hype313 |
| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 09:14 - Mar 2 by DJR |
I get the impression that Trump is effectively saying that if the Iranian people don't rise up and overthrow the regime, then it is their fault. |
That's what he's saying, but how can they go up against the IRGC without weapons? | |
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| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 09:16 - Mar 2 with 1456 views | Guthrum |
They aren't. It's just rhetoric, aka guff. Also a pre-excuse for failure when the regime doesn't simply capitulate as Mar-a-Lago's amateur diplomats expected.
All part of the pretence that they can win wars by floating around bombing stuff, without having to commit troops on the ground (who might then get killed). |  |
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| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 09:45 - Mar 2 with 1313 views | GlasgowBlue |
And with 40000 of the murdered in the past month alone their numbers and moral will be severely depleted.
This needs the army to turn against the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps. |  |
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| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 11:06 - Mar 2 with 1165 views | mellowblue |
The organisational ability of any opposition was most likely chopped off at the kneecaps recently, any attempt has to be on the scale of a revolution of a million people or so or it will be a bloodbath. Regime change always was very unlikely to happen without US boots on the ground. And even if it did happen , it could easily end in a fractured mess like Libya today, with many armed groups competing for power . |  | | |
| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 11:32 - Mar 2 with 1079 views | Pinewoodblue |
| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 11:06 - Mar 2 by mellowblue |
The organisational ability of any opposition was most likely chopped off at the kneecaps recently, any attempt has to be on the scale of a revolution of a million people or so or it will be a bloodbath. Regime change always was very unlikely to happen without US boots on the ground. And even if it did happen , it could easily end in a fractured mess like Libya today, with many armed groups competing for power . |
Iran is the size of Alaska with a population of over 90,000,000. Troops on the ground would be impossible. Another thing to consider is the diverse population, only 60% are Persians there are many minority groups, Kurds etc.
Divide & conquer sounds like a good idea but it really isn’t and would not bring peace to the Region.
Just heard that the three US aircraft that crashed in Kuwait yesterday were downed by friendly fire. |  |
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| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 12:48 - Mar 2 with 936 views | mellowblue |
| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 11:32 - Mar 2 by Pinewoodblue |
Iran is the size of Alaska with a population of over 90,000,000. Troops on the ground would be impossible. Another thing to consider is the diverse population, only 60% are Persians there are many minority groups, Kurds etc.
Divide & conquer sounds like a good idea but it really isn’t and would not bring peace to the Region.
Just heard that the three US aircraft that crashed in Kuwait yesterday were downed by friendly fire. |
I'm not necessarily advocating it, it is clearly not on Trump's agenda anyway. It would have been doable if the will to do it was there. Iraq is probably a third the size and half the population of Iran and the major fighting ended pretty quickly twice. The insurgency and inter-factional fighting went on for a good deal longer. As you say gaining a lasting peace would be a challenge. But it does have a long history of civilisation and a strong intelligentsia and middle class and has been orientated to the West before. Afghanistan it is not. | | | |
| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 14:51 - Mar 2 with 852 views | OldFart71 |
It's virtually impossible for the US to win a war without boots on the ground. You can take out military command bases and as proved their leaders. But because of the Ayatollah being of his age they would have expected to have someone in his place and although they wouldn't have expected so many personnel to be killed in one go there will be people to take their place and providing the national guard remains loyal they can still have a stranglehold on it's citizens and many remain loyal to the regime.
The worst thing that can happen and did happen in Vietnam, Iraq and Afghanistan is that the Americans do half a job and then pull out leaving an even worse situation, many dead including some of their own for nothing.
Considering the world apparently has so many intelligent people in it lessons are never learnt. War to end all wars never happens because of mad people in high places. | | | |
| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 20:07 - Mar 2 with 700 views | LeoMuff |
I’m intrigued as to why nobody asks Trump or Leavitt why when he apparently destroyed all of Irans nuclear capacity in June last year, the current main rationale for this round of bombing is to prevent Iran getting a nuclear weapon ? |  |
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| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 20:07 - Mar 2 with 700 views | SuperKieranMcKenna |
| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 09:45 - Mar 2 by GlasgowBlue |
And with 40000 of the murdered in the past month alone their numbers and moral will be severely depleted.
This needs the army to turn against the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps. |
Weird one to downvote… | | | |
| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 20:13 - Mar 2 with 662 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 20:07 - Mar 2 by SuperKieranMcKenna |
Weird one to downvote… |
Nothing surprises me from those with a certain type of avatar these days. | |
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| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 20:13 - Mar 2 with 660 views | Swansea_Blue |
And saying to the regime to hand over their weapons. The same applies to that idea - who are they supposed to hand them over to? There’s no other organised authority in the state, no international forces or international organisations able to coordinate what would effectively be a surrender.
I suppose they could hand them over to the people who would immediately turn them back on the regime lol. |  |
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| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 21:33 - Mar 2 with 554 views | DJR |
| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 09:22 - Mar 2 by DJR |
It will still be their fault in Trump's eyes. 
For what it is worth, it strikes me that "regime change" is a moral excuse that Trump is using to try to justify what he has done (for which there is no legal basis), when the only real aim of both the US and Israel is to destroy Iran's military capability.
And there was this on the BBC website.
On whether the Iranian regime can be overthrown without ground force, former CIA chief David Petraeus says it "depends on who emerges". But he is "quite confident" that Donald Trump "does not want to do that". [Post edited 2 Mar 9:30]
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Here's an update which would appear to reflect what I said..
Marco Rubio reiterated what Donald Trump and Pete Hegseth said earlier on Monday that regime change in Iran was not the objective of the US-Israeli combat operation.
But Rubio added that the US hoped Iranians would topple the regime.
“We hope that the Iranian people can overthrow this government and establish a new future for that country. We would love for that to be possible,” Rubio told reporters.
“But the objective of this mission is the destruction of their ballistic missile capabilities and of their naval capabilities,” he added. [Post edited 2 Mar 21:34]
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| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 22:52 - Mar 2 with 481 views | darkhorse28 |
| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 09:16 - Mar 2 by Guthrum |
They aren't. It's just rhetoric, aka guff. Also a pre-excuse for failure when the regime doesn't simply capitulate as Mar-a-Lago's amateur diplomats expected.
All part of the pretence that they can win wars by floating around bombing stuff, without having to commit troops on the ground (who might then get killed). |
They lost men already. If they put boots on the ground, you’d hate that also.
Iran is for its people to decide, if they want it badly enough they will rise up, the heavy lifting is been done as much as possible .., I’m sure unofficially there will be lots of US intelligence in the ground to support also.
I have to ask, you’ve never lived in the Middle East have you?
It’s easy to sit in an armchair and make all the pieces fit your bias and bigotry, through the prism of confirmation bias and what you crave to be true.
Have you ever had a thought that Trump could get something right, ever? However unpopular it might be, or how ever little social status there would be for you.
He was right on Quatar in 2018, he’s probably right in Venezuela and Iran too.
I didn’t like him either - but you’d have to be in his mirror image, to be SO reductive and tribal not to recognise he gets some things very right.
I’m fascinated by the hard left. Supported Putin. Support extreme Islamic states.
Why do they get so excited by control, dogma, hating gay prople, woman, and zero democracy .., it’s so cruel and lacking human empathy…, even the ‘but we don’t want to intefer’ narrative collapses when they obsess about Trump 24/7 …, it’s borderline evil. No empathy for people at all.
The bodies need to be their own tribe - or they don’t count. A lot in common with many Islamic states in that regard. | | | |
| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 23:33 - Mar 2 with 440 views | reusersfreekicks |
| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 22:52 - Mar 2 by darkhorse28 |
They lost men already. If they put boots on the ground, you’d hate that also.
Iran is for its people to decide, if they want it badly enough they will rise up, the heavy lifting is been done as much as possible .., I’m sure unofficially there will be lots of US intelligence in the ground to support also.
I have to ask, you’ve never lived in the Middle East have you?
It’s easy to sit in an armchair and make all the pieces fit your bias and bigotry, through the prism of confirmation bias and what you crave to be true.
Have you ever had a thought that Trump could get something right, ever? However unpopular it might be, or how ever little social status there would be for you.
He was right on Quatar in 2018, he’s probably right in Venezuela and Iran too.
I didn’t like him either - but you’d have to be in his mirror image, to be SO reductive and tribal not to recognise he gets some things very right.
I’m fascinated by the hard left. Supported Putin. Support extreme Islamic states.
Why do they get so excited by control, dogma, hating gay prople, woman, and zero democracy .., it’s so cruel and lacking human empathy…, even the ‘but we don’t want to intefer’ narrative collapses when they obsess about Trump 24/7 …, it’s borderline evil. No empathy for people at all.
The bodies need to be their own tribe - or they don’t count. A lot in common with many Islamic states in that regard. |
Wow!
What a load of hate filled totally inaccurate b/s.
Worse than your football posts and that is some achievement.
How have the lives of ordinary people improved in Venezuela?
Based on what you say you must be intimately experienced in that country.
If you think Trump gives 2 hoots about the Iranian people you are more bonkers than he is.
So what do you recommend normal Iranian people do faced by the ruthless heavily armed Iranian National Guard? Charge them with clubs?
And if you think Guthrum, one of the most knowledgeable and balanced posters on here is far left then your judgment is off the scale crazy.
And is it the far left in USA siding with Putin over Ukraine?
In Hungary? In Slovakia?
Totally idiotic |  | | |
| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 00:22 - Mar 3 with 394 views | WicklowBlue |
| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 22:52 - Mar 2 by darkhorse28 |
They lost men already. If they put boots on the ground, you’d hate that also.
Iran is for its people to decide, if they want it badly enough they will rise up, the heavy lifting is been done as much as possible .., I’m sure unofficially there will be lots of US intelligence in the ground to support also.
I have to ask, you’ve never lived in the Middle East have you?
It’s easy to sit in an armchair and make all the pieces fit your bias and bigotry, through the prism of confirmation bias and what you crave to be true.
Have you ever had a thought that Trump could get something right, ever? However unpopular it might be, or how ever little social status there would be for you.
He was right on Quatar in 2018, he’s probably right in Venezuela and Iran too.
I didn’t like him either - but you’d have to be in his mirror image, to be SO reductive and tribal not to recognise he gets some things very right.
I’m fascinated by the hard left. Supported Putin. Support extreme Islamic states.
Why do they get so excited by control, dogma, hating gay prople, woman, and zero democracy .., it’s so cruel and lacking human empathy…, even the ‘but we don’t want to intefer’ narrative collapses when they obsess about Trump 24/7 …, it’s borderline evil. No empathy for people at all.
The bodies need to be their own tribe - or they don’t count. A lot in common with many Islamic states in that regard. |
If this helps with your narrative, though I suspect it wont at all.
In short the US just admitted they preemptively took action against Iran after learning Israel was going to take action:
"Speaking this evening, US Secretary of State Marco Rubio said that the United States attacked Iran "pre-emptively" on Saturday after learning that ally Israel was going to strike, which would have meant retaliation against US forces.
"We knew that if we didn't pre-emptively go after them before they launched those attacks, we would suffer higher casualties," Mr Rubio told reporters."
What an absolute cluster fùck...and now Iran has closed the Strait of Hormuz and the US is urging citizens to leave effectively the Gulf region.
Where are any adults in the room here? The fallout from these attacks could have been anticipated easily. Who is leading who, from the above sounds like israel is calling the shots.
Time will tell, oh and Israel have closed the Gaza border crossings too as last I read. Stating that in times of war...
Not going to lean into well discussed aspects here. But both Israel and the US have on the face of it serous amounts of more blood on their hands and no idea what they have just caused.
Edit: forgot the source for Rubio's preemptive comments: https://www.rte.ie/news/middle [Post edited 3 Mar 0:25]
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| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 01:40 - Mar 3 with 342 views | ElderGrizzly |
| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 09:14 - Mar 2 by DJR |
I get the impression that Trump is effectively saying that if the Iranian people don't rise up and overthrow the regime, then it is their fault. |
Also, Israel apparently dictated the attack on Iran.
So rather stopping Israel attacking, they attacked first
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| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 09:09 - Mar 3 with 208 views | LeoMuff |
| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 22:52 - Mar 2 by darkhorse28 |
They lost men already. If they put boots on the ground, you’d hate that also.
Iran is for its people to decide, if they want it badly enough they will rise up, the heavy lifting is been done as much as possible .., I’m sure unofficially there will be lots of US intelligence in the ground to support also.
I have to ask, you’ve never lived in the Middle East have you?
It’s easy to sit in an armchair and make all the pieces fit your bias and bigotry, through the prism of confirmation bias and what you crave to be true.
Have you ever had a thought that Trump could get something right, ever? However unpopular it might be, or how ever little social status there would be for you.
He was right on Quatar in 2018, he’s probably right in Venezuela and Iran too.
I didn’t like him either - but you’d have to be in his mirror image, to be SO reductive and tribal not to recognise he gets some things very right.
I’m fascinated by the hard left. Supported Putin. Support extreme Islamic states.
Why do they get so excited by control, dogma, hating gay prople, woman, and zero democracy .., it’s so cruel and lacking human empathy…, even the ‘but we don’t want to intefer’ narrative collapses when they obsess about Trump 24/7 …, it’s borderline evil. No empathy for people at all.
The bodies need to be their own tribe - or they don’t count. A lot in common with many Islamic states in that regard. |
Quatar 2017 was a diplomatic spat, hardly bombing another country and taking out their leader. It’s not for Trump to decide a countries future particularly when he has openly decided he wants access to their natural resources.
He has now threatened Greenland for their resources, sold out Ukraine for theirs, killed civilians in venuzuala for oil and now killing civilians in Iran for reasons unknown as the only legitimate reason was to stop their nuclear programs, which happened last year. This after promising help for the uprising and standing by by while they were massacred.
It’s indefensible and fair play to Starmer for pushing back at least a degree | |
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| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 10:21 - Mar 3 with 144 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Trump saying to the Iranians "over to you" on 01:40 - Mar 3 by ElderGrizzly |
Also, Israel apparently dictated the attack on Iran.
So rather stopping Israel attacking, they attacked first
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Do you honestly believe that or do you think that the US are using that as an excuse to bypass international law? | |
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