| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad 14:01 - Nov 3 with 1946 views | unstableblue |
I do hope things turn around for George Hirst at Stoke.
When he’s playing at his best he’d a good striker and front man.
He had some decent appearances for us in the last premier league campaign.
And scored crucial goals at League One and Champ level for us.
Always been a streaky player I think. |  |
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| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 14:11 - Nov 3 with 1786 views | Mookamoo |
One of those players that was at his limit when playing in a McKenna team, and can only get there with McKenna coaching him and those around him.
There is a long long list of players who have moved on who can't get anywhere near the level they produced when here. |  | | |
| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 14:39 - Nov 3 with 1684 views | Metal_Hacker |
| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 14:11 - Nov 3 by Mookamoo |
One of those players that was at his limit when playing in a McKenna team, and can only get there with McKenna coaching him and those around him.
There is a long long list of players who have moved on who can't get anywhere near the level they produced when here. |
Wes and Chaplin aren't pulling up trees at Leicester
OK that said not many are but we're talking ex KMcK boys |  |
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| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 15:51 - Nov 3 with 1521 views | homer_123 |
| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 14:11 - Nov 3 by Mookamoo |
One of those players that was at his limit when playing in a McKenna team, and can only get there with McKenna coaching him and those around him.
There is a long long list of players who have moved on who can't get anywhere near the level they produced when here. |
We were always greater than the sum of our parts.
KM and Sir BR had something in common in that regard. |  |
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| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 16:16 - Nov 3 with 1438 views | WolfieAtTheBack |
| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 14:11 - Nov 3 by Mookamoo |
One of those players that was at his limit when playing in a McKenna team, and can only get there with McKenna coaching him and those around him.
There is a long long list of players who have moved on who can't get anywhere near the level they produced when here. |
McKenna is one of the best coaches in Europe and will go on to be an elite coach in his career.
The levels he got from those players is not to be underestimated, what he did for Ipswich Town Football club should not and will not be underestimated. [Post edited 3 Nov 16:16]
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| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 16:22 - Nov 3 with 1413 views | ITFC_Essex |
| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 15:51 - Nov 3 by homer_123 |
We were always greater than the sum of our parts.
KM and Sir BR had something in common in that regard. |
There's a difference in quality of player though, post Ipswich, Wark won the league twice with Liverpool, Talbot won the FA Cup with Arsenal, and Terry Butcher won the Scottish league three times, and played for England and the likes of Muhren, Thijsen, Osman, Burley, Gates, Mills, Mariner, Brazil all played in the top league for a good period after we sold them.
Of the McKenna players not at Ipswich, Delap is the only one playing top flight footy in England, Woolfenden has yet to play this season for Coventry, Hutch is at AC milan,Axel T is playing top level football in France, and Azon, Spain, the rest have ended up Championship and lower. |  |
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| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 16:53 - Nov 3 with 1316 views | DJR |
| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 16:22 - Nov 3 by ITFC_Essex |
There's a difference in quality of player though, post Ipswich, Wark won the league twice with Liverpool, Talbot won the FA Cup with Arsenal, and Terry Butcher won the Scottish league three times, and played for England and the likes of Muhren, Thijsen, Osman, Burley, Gates, Mills, Mariner, Brazil all played in the top league for a good period after we sold them.
Of the McKenna players not at Ipswich, Delap is the only one playing top flight footy in England, Woolfenden has yet to play this season for Coventry, Hutch is at AC milan,Axel T is playing top level football in France, and Azon, Spain, the rest have ended up Championship and lower. |
The 1981 team had 11 internationals who played or had played for international teams (including Scotland) who were pretty decent in world terms at that time.
I don't include Ireland or Northern Ireland in that list but both Allan Hunter and Kevin O'Callaghan were also internationals and played that season.
We also mustn't underestimate the quality of the players in earlier teams who kept us in the top division for many years. David Johnson in particular springs to mind who went on to have an even better career with Liverpool. But others such as Whymark (who won one England cap) chose to stay with Ipswich for much of their career. [Post edited 3 Nov 16:58]
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| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 16:54 - Nov 3 with 1299 views | billlm |
| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 16:22 - Nov 3 by ITFC_Essex |
There's a difference in quality of player though, post Ipswich, Wark won the league twice with Liverpool, Talbot won the FA Cup with Arsenal, and Terry Butcher won the Scottish league three times, and played for England and the likes of Muhren, Thijsen, Osman, Burley, Gates, Mills, Mariner, Brazil all played in the top league for a good period after we sold them.
Of the McKenna players not at Ipswich, Delap is the only one playing top flight footy in England, Woolfenden has yet to play this season for Coventry, Hutch is at AC milan,Axel T is playing top level football in France, and Azon, Spain, the rest have ended up Championship and lower. |
Il question that, Delap does not play football, |  | | |
| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 18:56 - Nov 3 with 1142 views | blueoutlook |
| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 15:51 - Nov 3 by homer_123 |
We were always greater than the sum of our parts.
KM and Sir BR had something in common in that regard. |
The difference in quality were worlds apart. Bobbys team were far far superior. And a lot went on to top clubs and performed for years after. |  | | |
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| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 19:23 - Nov 3 with 1090 views | armchaircritic59 |
| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 16:16 - Nov 3 by WolfieAtTheBack |
McKenna is one of the best coaches in Europe and will go on to be an elite coach in his career.
The levels he got from those players is not to be underestimated, what he did for Ipswich Town Football club should not and will not be underestimated. [Post edited 3 Nov 16:16]
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Could have maybe unintentionally hit the nail on the head. Looks to have all the makings of an elite coach. Whether that transfers to elite manager ( different roles ), time will tell. That is of course always assuming that's the path he wishes to pursue. It wouldn't greatly surprise me if he turned up abroad in some capacity before too long. |  | | |
| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 19:31 - Nov 3 with 1076 views | WolfieAtTheBack |
| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 19:23 - Nov 3 by armchaircritic59 |
Could have maybe unintentionally hit the nail on the head. Looks to have all the makings of an elite coach. Whether that transfers to elite manager ( different roles ), time will tell. That is of course always assuming that's the path he wishes to pursue. It wouldn't greatly surprise me if he turned up abroad in some capacity before too long. |
Mckenna worked alongside Mourinho.
Mourinho learnt his craft from Robson.
Put two and two together and McKenna completed that full circle and got us back to being a decent football club both on and off the grass. | | | |
| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 19:33 - Nov 3 with 1071 views | TripSwitch |
| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 14:11 - Nov 3 by Mookamoo |
One of those players that was at his limit when playing in a McKenna team, and can only get there with McKenna coaching him and those around him.
There is a long long list of players who have moved on who can't get anywhere near the level they produced when here. |
Im not sure, I think it goes deeper than that with Hirst.
For 2 or 3 years he was a versatile, reliable, and unselfish target man, whose physicality, ability to hold up play and play in others made the players around him shine. He was also very good at making runs in behind and an aerial threat, a complete striker.
But the drop off in his game from the end of the 24/25 season to the start of last was stark. He seemed to lose a ton of technical ability over the summer (first touch, making ball stick) and his finishing, never his strong suit anyway, became very erratic.
Frankly he looked a donkey for large parts of last season which is why Azon got so much game time. And that pattern has continued at Stoke.
All very odd. [Post edited 3 Nov 19:34]
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| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 19:53 - Nov 3 with 1021 views | Stenvict |
He was dropped before the previous International break. |  |
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| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 20:11 - Nov 3 with 991 views | unstableblue |
| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 19:53 - Nov 3 by Stenvict |
He was dropped before the previous International break. |
Yes indeed Sébastien Pocognoli selected his first Scotland squad for the last (extended international break) Nations League fixtures - and I think he put Oli McBurnie in for Hirst?? Having not been selected for ages. | |
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| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 21:32 - Nov 3 with 894 views | Sharkey |
It would all feel a lot worse for Hirst if Stoke were struggling and he couldn't get in the team. But it must be a happy training ground as they win almost every week. Plenty of season left for him to get in the groove if/when his chance comes to start. |  | | |
| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 21:39 - Nov 3 with 875 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 19:33 - Nov 3 by TripSwitch |
Im not sure, I think it goes deeper than that with Hirst.
For 2 or 3 years he was a versatile, reliable, and unselfish target man, whose physicality, ability to hold up play and play in others made the players around him shine. He was also very good at making runs in behind and an aerial threat, a complete striker.
But the drop off in his game from the end of the 24/25 season to the start of last was stark. He seemed to lose a ton of technical ability over the summer (first touch, making ball stick) and his finishing, never his strong suit anyway, became very erratic.
Frankly he looked a donkey for large parts of last season which is why Azon got so much game time. And that pattern has continued at Stoke.
All very odd. [Post edited 3 Nov 19:34]
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Is it odd? He possibly just peaked. Most players apart from the absolute best aren’t robots. We were clinging on to his unselfish play as a way to justify his place, if we’re being honest. As Championship strikers go he was never close to being in the top group despite his team being one of the better ones. Or in short, maybe he’s just not as good as we convinced ourselves he was? |  |
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| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 21:53 - Nov 3 with 843 views | TripSwitch |
| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 21:39 - Nov 3 by Swansea_Blue |
Is it odd? He possibly just peaked. Most players apart from the absolute best aren’t robots. We were clinging on to his unselfish play as a way to justify his place, if we’re being honest. As Championship strikers go he was never close to being in the top group despite his team being one of the better ones. Or in short, maybe he’s just not as good as we convinced ourselves he was? |
Agree to disagree, I thought at times he looked like he could cause PL defenders some problems in our first stint in the PL but hes obviously miles off that standard now.
Maybe you're right, and he peaked and is on the downward slope now. | |
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| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 06:26 - Nov 4 with 614 views | Blue_Heath |
| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 21:53 - Nov 3 by TripSwitch |
Agree to disagree, I thought at times he looked like he could cause PL defenders some problems in our first stint in the PL but hes obviously miles off that standard now.
Maybe you're right, and he peaked and is on the downward slope now. |
I think we definitely had him at his peak and maybe how we played suited him.
I thought he was one of the better players towards the end of the prem era.
As someone earlier said always been a streaky player, think we did well there to get the best out of him and sell him at a decent profit. | |
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| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 07:09 - Nov 4 with 555 views | Bluemike31 |
| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 21:39 - Nov 3 by Swansea_Blue |
Is it odd? He possibly just peaked. Most players apart from the absolute best aren’t robots. We were clinging on to his unselfish play as a way to justify his place, if we’re being honest. As Championship strikers go he was never close to being in the top group despite his team being one of the better ones. Or in short, maybe he’s just not as good as we convinced ourselves he was? |
Agree completely and to be honest I never thought he was as good as some made him out to be, For the last season and a half he was here his game went to pot, first touch, movement, goalscoring etc, just wasn't there, obviously some don't like the criticism of him and I get it but for me what we got paid for George was ridiculous and so it is being proven, at the end he was dropped here for Azon, dropped by Stoke and dropped by Scotland., I think the pattern is clear. | | | |
| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 09:22 - Nov 4 with 429 views | Mookamoo |
| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 16:22 - Nov 3 by ITFC_Essex |
There's a difference in quality of player though, post Ipswich, Wark won the league twice with Liverpool, Talbot won the FA Cup with Arsenal, and Terry Butcher won the Scottish league three times, and played for England and the likes of Muhren, Thijsen, Osman, Burley, Gates, Mills, Mariner, Brazil all played in the top league for a good period after we sold them.
Of the McKenna players not at Ipswich, Delap is the only one playing top flight footy in England, Woolfenden has yet to play this season for Coventry, Hutch is at AC milan,Axel T is playing top level football in France, and Azon, Spain, the rest have ended up Championship and lower. |
Does highlight the difference in scouting in those two eras. Robson was very much about finding talent and moulding them into a top team. I imagine there was very little data science about it, it was all in the guts of Ron Gray and Charlie Woods.
McKenna found the building blocks with the right attributes with an awful lot of spreadsheets involved. | | | |
| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 09:34 - Nov 4 with 405 views | MathieandMarshall |
My boss is a Stoke season ticket holder and he's asked me on several occasions if I can collect Hirst and bring him back to Ipswich with me! cant believe they paid so much for him. He said to me last week that he doesn't even know how to run the channels and is useless.
Sad to hear as although he didn't have a great final season at Town and seemed devoid of confidence there is a player in there! as we saw in the back to back promotions. Attackers tend to be confidence players and for whatever reason his is shot to pieces currently. |  | | |
| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 10:09 - Nov 4 with 366 views | RetroBlue |
| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 14:39 - Nov 3 by Metal_Hacker |
Wes and Chaplin aren't pulling up trees at Leicester
OK that said not many are but we're talking ex KMcK boys |
I would add to that, that some of these players have sustained significant injuries , arnt particularly young now, and playing for clubs that are operating at a lower (more ohysical) league and possibly using different tactics than McKenna did. Players under various managers, not just McKenna, often fail to show when they move on. One incoming example of this was Szmodics. |  |
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| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 11:29 - Nov 4 with 301 views | ITFC_Essex |
| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 06:26 - Nov 4 by Blue_Heath |
I think we definitely had him at his peak and maybe how we played suited him.
I thought he was one of the better players towards the end of the prem era.
As someone earlier said always been a streaky player, think we did well there to get the best out of him and sell him at a decent profit. |
His best season for us, was last season - 11 goals in the second tier.
Watch the QPR highlights, that George Hirst is a very good upper Championship player. But he was playing in a team of good players he could link with. He's now in a Stoke side trying to scrape a playoff place with the umpteen identikit Champ sides.
You do need good players around you too. | |
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| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 13:00 - Nov 4 with 241 views | _CliveBaker_ |
| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 18:56 - Nov 3 by blueoutlook |
The difference in quality were worlds apart. Bobbys team were far far superior. And a lot went on to top clubs and performed for years after. |
The levels were too though, to be fair.
McKenna did it in the 2nd tier, so its all relative. |  | | |
| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 13:32 - Nov 4 with 181 views | SirBobbysBoys |
I believe he's only getting the odd sub appearance currently at Stoke? From the match reports I have seen, seems he's getting 20 mins at the end of the game. Hardly fair chance to make a name for himself. |  | | |
| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 13:52 - Nov 4 with 123 views | NedPlimpton |
| Hirst dropped from Scotland squad on 11:29 - Nov 4 by ITFC_Essex |
His best season for us, was last season - 11 goals in the second tier.
Watch the QPR highlights, that George Hirst is a very good upper Championship player. But he was playing in a team of good players he could link with. He's now in a Stoke side trying to scrape a playoff place with the umpteen identikit Champ sides.
You do need good players around you too. |
So Hirst is only a good player when the rest of the team are a higher level than upper-mid championship? This doesn't really make much sense to me
I think it's pretty obvious there's been a drop off in form from him and you're just trying to find reasons to knock Stoke rather than be critical of Hirst |  | | |
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